Talk:World 5/@comment-37955540-20190206044221/@comment-103.208.220.147-20190207054123

I'll leave you why my argument is relevant.

I just do not get why people are complaning about 5-5.

- Use a sub-optimal comp -> blame rng and Tanaka

The problem is optimal comps cease to be optimal and only the select best few survive the buff. Other people keep telling you same things that lead to anti-progression being the conclusion but you just shrug it off with "what are you people on about it's still doable".

'''You can clear 5-5 with less optimal comps if you really want, and gradually use a better one. Just because 5-5 is a harder map, it does not change the fact that you can clear with sub-optimal comps. 50% easy boss encounters, and you enter boss node with no ammo penalty and slight evasion penalty.'''

A coin that says win on one side and lose on another. But getting the win side of the coin and people better off pray to RNG that FS protection mechanism doesn't divert their attacks from Wo-KFS to the surviving SWP escort in diamond formation at night because none of their ships can kill the latter, when they previously could.

'''Old 5-5 is even harder than that, as the first node used to be normal node and submarine nodes used to cost you 20%/20%. And no one appreciates that.'''

And yet a Kongou fleet with carriers became viable later on with guarantee of less salt, and so is 6-5 south route. Did they get better or worse over time?

Remember, there was no 4-5 and 6-5, and you can obtain 4 medals per month.

What? Just because you used to make 4 medals per month, it justifies that 1 medal per month should be taken from players with a flip of a switch? Dude, you don't even need to care about BPs running scarce. You've even improved heaviest guns while there are people who still have to chase blueprints and then this happened. What's your argument? That you only had to farm 4 medals per month so people shouldn't cry about it? Go ride a cattle on a highway then since cars didn't exist until late 19th century. I thought I made it clear about how players can play 3-5, old 5-5, and 6-5 better over time but that doesn't matter because poor you only had 4 medals per month when you started. You're willing to overlook the glaring progression bump the devs have (inadvertently) put up just to meet the difficulty criteria in the last event, especially with the fact that they tweeted afterwards that they nerfed the boss comp specifically after they acknowledged (thank god at least) the absurdity of the buff.

'''New 5-5 is just a new map, just like any other maps introduced during release of sequence 2. It is like saying "why my old 4-5 is that much worse now because the devs changed routing?". Putting old comp to a new map, and expect it to work out of the box, is just rediculous.'''

This is not going from old map to new one. This is the same map since Phase 2 that's jacked up recently just because for some reason the devs decided that the same SWP should appear in the last event. The main issue is that the difficulty as well as the map got out of hand, not players needing easy doggo walk to get what they want. Imagine an MMORPG where an old Lv.30 map that has crucial materials for crafting suddenly jacks up to Lv.60 just for the sake of veterans. That's what happened.

'''Devs give you more, and you complain about it... Good lord.'''

Wow, if giving means taking more of your resources to sortie LSC ships in the same map that you're familiar with... Hey, it's taking back while giving more work to do at the same pace as usual.

Fixed routines with fixed comps, always wins with ease, and laugh about it?

I'm sure that no one laughs monthly when getting medals from these maps.

If you only add easy contents, then what is left for the veterans to enjoy?

Look who doesn't get it? I have never asked for easy shit, not in my state. Don't put that in people's mouths. The devs could've done something like sortieing 4DDs to 5-5 thrice quests or sortieing some bizarre fleet to west route in 4-5, instead of permabuffing SWP herself since updates come monthly. Oh wait. They did, like the new year quests in which you had to sortie DDs to 4-5. I thought that was a good job, in my state that is. They even made World 7 and 7-3 is on the way as we speak. They can do much more for veterans that buffing up the current maps should be the last thing to do, while at the same time showing newer players a more varied ways to catch up in order to withstand the events. So, why did they flip 5-5 upside down and leave it in its sorry state anyway? All I've said again and again is that this buff is anti-retention since it's anti-progression. If you think that going back to 4 medals per month is going to retain players, you lost the plot. Going back to when 5-5 changed itself upon Phase 2, I've never complained about the double Re comp any remotely as much as right now because I could still see a variety of ways to handle it. But then, overnight SWP became a riot bulletproof tank reactive armored sniper on which needs a select few shipgirls in their best health to even stand a chance to avoid inflicting non-scratches. Maybe I should try the CLTs next time. Who knows if the devs intended this.

The game as a whole, including 5-5, is perfectly playable for newbies.

If your only solution is Yamasushi and Nelson, then yeah it's perfectly playable for newbies apparently.

Talking about "progress", do you think a newbie makes more progress when he whines about everything and refuse to learn and adapt, or if he learns from his experience and better comps?

Yeah just suck it up coz we're bringing CA Hime in boisss. This guy is so high up on his horsie that he fails to see what's below when this buff affects the more positive players as well. Some of the players that you see lamenting are very competent, ya know? If they're complaining now but not before, it's more likely to not be player issue. At least Ekel presents his stance better here.

You've just confirmed in my mind that you're only speaking with elitism in mind, rather than for the sake of lifespan of the game itself. Mind you that I have no rants like this for event maps as they get harder over time as they should be, but one of the regular maps that rewards a much needed progression has become much tougher just because a few numbers have changed. Last time Destiny 2 did progression in with EXP throttling, it went so well. Oh wait. It didn't. Now that game is having a retention problem with even hardcore loyalists but that's due to a set of different matters. So do the same thing with this game as well, albeit slowly(?).

There are games that make progression towards older goals gradually easier while at the same time adding new things with higher difficulty to achieve, and one of them is an immensely popular F2P, more so than this game. That's the retention model for persistent games. This buff goes against the model and the healthier side of the playerbase is also negatively affected by it. To git gud isn't just something you should advise anyone in this case when the only way to git gud is made narrow to go through. I've said before: There are many ways to introduce challenges, such as new maps and quests. Hindering player's progress to get existing items isn't one of them. In fact, it's lazy. Ironic that you're talking about players whining when the devs took the laziest way out to buff up a map, just by changing a few numbers on a boss, and they did it horribly.